40. Bluegrass Distillers - Sam Rock

I think they typically use Pappy barrels.

Okay.

So, you know, stuff to compete with Pappy.

I think the whole world knows that, right? Well, you know what?

I always say that. If I'm getting beat by Pappy, I can handle it. You can handle that? Yeah.

But this is what I say to people, right? I've, I had a lot of people tell me, I do not like a weeded bourbon. And I'll probably say this every episode. I bet I could put a battle pappy in front of almost everybody and they're going to say, I'll drink that. I'm like, we like weeded bourbon then. Yeah. So why not try some of this other weeded bourbon that's out there? Give it a shot. It might be just as good.

Welcome to another trip down the Bourbon Road with your hosts, Jim and Mike. So grab a glass of your favorite bourbon and kick back.

We would like to thank Tommy and Gwen Mitchell from Log Heads Home Center for supporting this episode of the Bourbon Road. Find out more about their fine rustic furniture at logheadshomecenter.com.

Hello, everyone. I'm Jim Shannon. And I'm Mike Hyatt. And this is The Bourbon Road. And today, Mike, where are we? We are at Bluegrass Distillers in Lexington, Kentucky. And who do we have with us? We got Sam Rock.

Sam Rock. Do they call you The Rock? Somebody. Yeah. All right. Well, Sam, we don't spend a whole lot of time chit chatting. We'd like to get straight to the whiskey. So what are you pouring for us today in our first class?

Okay, the first glass is our blue corn weeded bourbon and it's a straight bourbon. I'm not exactly sure how old it is, but it's older than two years. We made it here. The mash bills, 75% blue corn, 21% wheat and 4% malted barley. And we do it all here. We had this corn grown for us right here in Lexington. Well, in the Lexington area. It was grown in Clark County. And that year it grew like mad. And then the next year we had it grown for us again and it got knocked down by a storm. But the blue corn is significantly more finicky than yellow corn. It's got more than one ear per stock. It's got like six or eight. So it's a real thin stock and can get blown over. And I think it's also a delicate, delicate spirit. And it's strange, but it has the same match bill as the yellow corn. And I like the yellow corn too, but it, it matures differently, both in color, in taste, it just manifests differently.

So earlier as you were talking about it, you weren't able to nail down the age on that. Is that because you have barrels that range from two years to three years and you're just not sure about this particular bottle?

I just don't, yeah, I just don't remember. I mean, it was probably a blend of a number of barrels, all that were straight. At the time we were making the blue corn, we were making some in smaller barrels, like 25 gallon barrels. Some were 30 and then others were 53. So they could be a combination of a 25 gallon barrel product and a 53 gallon, you know, and so it's, it's a, it's a blended bourbon.

So this is a small batch. Yeah. So there's some crafty blending going on. Yeah. But it's all, it's a straight bourbon. Right. It's a straight.

Let's try it. Maggie said, Maggie, uh, she, she told us that, uh, this was the last bottle of your blue corn before the new release.

Oh, it is. Okay.

She said this is, so we're drinking the last one.

We were supposed to be saving this one for a special occasion, which this is pretty special.

Oh, we like to think so. I love weeded bourbon. Jim would tell you that's my thing. I love weeded bourbon. It's great. And while you were talking, I've already been sipping on this.

Well, while you're talking about it then, I'm going to check it out.

It's got that, I'd say almost like old Maysville, it's got that apricot taste to it. And I could taste that. You said there was malted barley in this.

What was the barley percentage again? 4%. 4%. It smells like it might have a little bit more in it, didn't it?

And you said this was in 30, 35 gallon barrels?

Well, I'm sure it was a combination of 25 gallon barrels and a 53 or one or two 53s. I cannot remember how many barrels we put into this, but it's probably no more than four barrels. We haven't done anything that's bigger than four 53 gallon barrels.

Yeah, it's kind of funny on the nose. I mean, it's very sweet and it does have a delicate aspect to it. It's kind of floral. It's got that fruity, but it's got that light fruity smell to it. I really like that.

But Mike, it's got that same nose as a Sagamore.

Yeah. I mean, it's kind of got, it's kind of got that, uh, that light malty peachy nose to it. No doubt about it. I want to taste it.

When I'm trying our bourbons and all bourbons, I think, um, because some of the bourbon we made in the very beginning was really probably not very good. Having started from scratch with five gallon buckets and starting with a still that was on the flame. I'm always looking for a consistent ride from the time it hits your tongue to the time it goes down your throat. And I think the blue corn really fulfills that my personal desire. Cause, um, you know, we made some stuff and I'm using myself as an example because I never want to use anybody else, um, that, you know, really had a bite on the end and it would just make you thirsty. That gets like, um, So, you know, but I don't feel like that this does that. It has the other nice sweet notes and it has a good nose and it doesn't have much of a burn and you can obviously taste some nice caramel and sugar. But it definitely has a sweet finish on it.

So how does your law, your by trade, right? You're a Kentucky boy. You grew up in Woodford County. How do you go from being in the courtroom to, I mean, I want to open up a distillery. Were you living down the stream from a distillery or something?

Well, I grew up in Woodford County. So We used to, I used to fish at Woodford Reserve before it was Woodford Reserve. It was just a warehouse with moss on it. And then old Taylor, which is now Casseline Key, was a place I was very familiar with when I was a kid. And I never put two and two together when I was growing up that Millville, was the Millville for bourbon. You know, it was just Millville. It was like Nonesuch or Troy or Keene or one of these areas, other areas. So, and we used to canoe Clear Creek and One time we got out of school because there was too much rain. It was, we were flooding and, um, and we put football helmets on and tried to kayak or canoe down. We went about a hundred yards and flipped over. I'm surprised I'm alive really. But, um, so back to your question, I, um, you know, I've been a lawyer for now been over 20 years and, um, I'm a little bit long in the tooth for it, but My business partner, Nathan Brown, and I owned a tax business that was a Spanish speaking tax business. We primarily did tax returns for undocumented workers. And we, in the late 2000s, were acquired by another company, and I moved with them at a state. And, uh, and so I ended up in Atlanta and, uh, I was dating who is now my current wife, who is from living here. She's actually from Oregon, but, um, we started talking about, you know, I didn't know if she was going to come down there and I was going to come back here. And I thought, you know, if I'm going to go back to Kentucky and kind of like restart. I just don't want to be practicing law again. I just don't want to go back and compete with everybody for books of business they've already got. And so I wanted to do something in addition. So Nathan called me, it was already on my mind and he is in the reclaimed wood business and he said, Hey, do you want to go down to old Taylor and look at this warehouse? You know, you probably know about it. And I was like, oh yeah, I know, I know that place almost like the back of my hand, you know? So we went down and we looked at that piece of property. Um, and he was looking at it to tear down the building. And I was like, man, I don't know from a, from a lawyer's standpoint, this just looks like a terrible idea. We already knew one had fallen down, you know, if it fell down, killed somebody, I mean, you know, Um, and this is one of the warehouses that they ultimately took down, but so then we were just walking around and saw all the mash tines and everything. And so this is like 2011, maybe or 2012, early 2012. Um, then. we just started talking about what about the bourbon business? It really happened like that, totally organic. So we also had had another conversation and other conversations that if we ever got back into business together, it would be a business that was more fun and that people enjoyed. I mean, you can't get any different from doing tax returns to making bourbon. the customer experience.

And I think you did find something that's kind of fun.

It's fun to drink. It's fun to make even in the process of building this distillery and making these barrels and just making the payments out of our pocket. It's always been fun. I mean, it's all, there's no part about it. I mean, filing federal reports is not fun, but it's been fun the whole time. And so we also wanted a business that involved sort of the growth of an asset base, which bourbon is. So, and people don't really think about that a lot, that it, you know, why is it unlike beer or some other things, you know, your inventory gets more valuable as it gets older. And so, you know, we look at it like that. You know, we're able to produce a value product, which is one of the reasons why we don't buy, why we don't buy a bourbon, because we're able to produce it.

And we're sitting in your barrel room here. And I mean, to you, this is Fort Knox, right? Mm-hmm. This is where your assets are stored. It's a little tiny Fort Knox. A tiny Fort Knox, but still. I mean, there's a lot of barrels in this room. Yeah.

I mean, you start counting. There's a little bit of money in here.

Yeah.

It's a... Once it ages a while, right?

Yeah. I mean, it doesn't, according to the state government, doesn't get any value until it hits two years. But I mean, I could, I could sell all of them. I mean, tomorrow, if, if we couldn't make a payment on something, we could call my friend who's a barrel broker and say, we've got 30 barrels to sell. And he would say, how old is it? And he would say, what's a mash bill? And I would say, it's this and this. And he would say, okay, I'll give you a check for this. And that's just fantastic. Yeah. You know, that is like, We don't have a mortgage on these things, but we could. But when we first started talking to bankers about raising some money, they weren't very interested in financing barrels, but they are today. We're not asking them today, but we will be asking them soon.

It's a learning process for the banks too. It's a liquid asset and they need to be able to loan against it, right?

Yeah, and you know, I mean, the thoroughbred business didn't go so great in the late 80s form and early 90s. So, I mean, I think they're like, they look at bourbon as akin to a horse or a coal mine. Like, where could this go for us?

Now, Mike, I want to turn back to this bourbon for a minute here. Have you been sipping on it? I haven't drank that whole glass. I saw that. He's already finished his. Now, this is my first drink of the day. Shame on me. It's already, what, five o'clock?

Yeah.

But it kind of gave me that cinnamon palate right up front there.

That blue corn is definitely there. I liked it. Being a weeded bourbon guy, I think there's nothing better. Some people can say what they want to say about weeded bourbon. I see more and more distilleries coming up with a weeded bourbon expression, and there's something to be said about that. Oh, yeah. People were that sweeter palette like dessert. I think that would be a after-dinner whiskey that I could sip on with dessert or something like that. I think it's really good.

But that light upfront sweetness you get from the wheat, it's nice. It's got a corn sweetness to it too, but the caramel is strong in it, I think. It's got a nice little touch of vanilla. I think it's a fresh pear, I think. Yeah, it's pear or peach. I don't know.

The terrible thing is I'm never able to nail which one it is, but are you going to go home and grab a can of peaches?

That's really good. Cheers to you. Great job done on this bourbon. And so the one that's releasing next is a little closer to three years than I would say. Okay.

Yeah, that should be, it'll be out. The cola is approved. So it'll be done and it's the same cola. So it'll come out in, um, January or no, the first weekend of February.

Okay. So about three weeks from when we're recording here, but probably only about two weeks after the show airs. So yeah, you'll be on the lookout for it. So this is, uh, this is called your blue corn bourbon. It's a, uh, it's a, it's a weeded bourbon and, uh, this, would you call this your flagship?

I think I would call it. Yeah, probably.

Yeah.

I mean, I think it, uh, You know, bourbons often just relate to age, but in terms of like something no one else is doing, that's really it. I mean, other people are doing it. Don't get me wrong. But, um, in Kentucky, I think we're the only ones who have made a real run at making it our main thing. Um, again, we, it is our flagship. We have a lot of it and we dedicated a lot of race. We basically distilled, we distilled in cycles cause we do these different match bills and we dedicated, um, you know, over a year to distilling this, and it's a lot more expensive than the others. So, yeah, I think it's our flagship.

Where can our listeners get this at?

Well, here, obviously. And then when it comes out, our distributor, usually it goes to the big box places, Total Wine, it'll go to liquor barn. Cork and Barrel, which is a local liquor store, always buys it. Cork and Barrel has a lot of our stuff. You know, it'll probably go all over the place. There was another liquor store here, Wines on Vine, that had it. Um, and I think Justin's, um, Justin's house suburban. Yeah. I think they had it on the corner. Um, of course we'd like it to go everywhere. Sure.

I think at this point, um, if you get it into Kroger's, that's kind of everywhere.

Yeah.

I mean, at least in this area, regionally.

Yeah, we have other stuff in Kroger's. So, you know, Kroger's, Kroger is fantastic. And I think it's just a matter of whether they have the shelf space. I always go in and check out what's going on. And it's, I really, I don't know what their calculus is. They traditionally have the stuff you would expect. And then on the ends of shelves, they'll have, you know, stuff like us and stuff they're experimenting with. So yeah, hopefully we'll get into Kroger too. I mean, Kroger is a great, we've done barrel picks for Kroger. Kroger has, they've been really good to us.

Now, Mike, you've had one of the bluegrass barrel picks, haven't you? I did. I sipped on it last night beside my fire. It was a weeded bourbon. That's what caught my eye. I didn't go in there to buy that. I went in there to buy something else. But as soon as I see wheat, I almost flipped around. I was like, oh, I got to get that right there. And I asked the, actually, the store manager was there. And I said, hey, can you tell me something about this? And he said, yeah, we picked it. And we talked about it for a little bit. And I said, well, I'll buy that instead of what I was going to buy. I was glad I did. I liked it. Now, it's a little bit different than this blue corn, I think, you're weeding this. It's yellow, right? It's a yellow corn, yeah. It was a lot different, actually. And I actually liked the blue corn a little bit better, but still, it's a weeded bourbon. And I always tell Jim, one of my goals is to have the greatest weeded bourbon collection in the world one day. That would be my goal.

Hey, you're well on your way, I think.

My wife would say, she would say, I'm well on my way, too.

Your wife is going to want her own collection of something, if you're going to get that.

She has her own collection of tequila.

Oh, is that right?

She's half Venezuelan. And that's not, you know, Venezuelans, I think they drink more rum. But she loves her tequila, and she likes to drink it just like I like to drink my bourbon. Sometimes she'll drink bourbon with me. She likes her Kentucky meal is what she likes. Oh, interesting.

So why don't we move on down the road here a little bit and we'll talk about his next expression. And unless you have more questions on this, are we good? What do you have for us in our next class?

So what we have here is our yellow corn weeded single barrel. And this is unfiltered. So here at the distillery, we have what we consider our barrel growler rack. And we'll just put barrels up there and people can draw it out of the bottom with just basically a plumber's valve. So we don't proof it down. Whatever barrel we put up there is what, you know, we're going to be selling. This is, I think, 94 proofs. So this is a much older barrel. Now our barrels, we barrel everything at 120. We proof it down from 140 to 120. The barrel proof unfiltered product is a really raw product. I frankly love them, but they're all really different. The proofs will vary. Some will be at 107, 114, 90, 94. Once they all get to 120, it'll kind of be boring. But they're much thicker. You have a lot more heft on your tongue.

So walk me through this again and let's walk our listeners through this. So somebody comes to your distillery and wants to take a tour and as they're visiting your tasting room there, they can walk over to a racked barrel, turn a valve and fill a growler full of whiskey.

They can fill a normal you know, 750 or 375 bottle of whiskey.

Okay.

And so it could be a weeded bourbon or it could be a high rye bourbon. But we also sell it this way through distribution, but it's a higher price product. So the distributors typically don't take it. Um, and it's the same product that like a Kroger would buy. Um, but they would typically proof it down to 90 or a hundred. Um, obviously you get a lot less bottles when you don't proof it. Um, and you know, we do it, we came onto it really backwards. We had run out of bottles and, um, and somebody was here and they said, you know, we really want to buy a bottle. And I said, really all we've got is stuff in barrels and I can, I can pull it out. And I can prove it and I can figure out what the tax is, you know, or square with the federal government and basically, you know, write it down. Um, and. know, I'd heard that another distillery did something similar to that, but I had never really done it. And, um, and it really turned out to be something that people wanted, especially on the trail. So, you know, it's has the same skew as the other stuff. Um, and it's really a single barrel product, but it's not, it's unfiltered. So we just, um, in, you know, people As it gets further down in the barrel, it gets a lot darker. There's a lot more sugar. Um, and, um, there's a lot more char. And so this bottle is actually a bottle of 128. So this will be a really robust bourbon, which I haven't tried yet.

So this is, uh, so this is bottle 128.

This is bottle 128 out of, you'll, we'll typically get about 190 to 200 bottles out of a barrel when we put it up there. Whereas when you proof it down, you can get up to 240 because you're, you know, you're coming down to 90 proof and nobody else.

I don't, I don't know. There's one or two other places that will do that.

And Michter's has their filling line where you can do that at the gift shop, I think.

Yeah, it's a little bit different.

But I don't think. Nobody's doing growlers, right?

Well, they're not doing growlers. They're just doing barrels. You can't bring a growler here and do that. Right.

It's got to be our growler.

Yeah, your growler, your bottle, with your label on it and stuff. But I don't think anybody else is doing that. And I think that's a reason to draw people to you. A reason to come to Lexington before next year, right? Because you guys are planning to move. Man, what an experience to get your own whiskey out of a bottle. Man, that's a great experience right there.

People love it. Because people, when they're on the trail, they want to participate. Just when they're in the master room and we say, do you want to try it? They try it. But this is different. They can get underneath there and pull the valve. Now, what's the proof on this? 94, I think, right?

Yeah, 94 proof.

94.

But see, it tastes a lot different. It does. It really does. So this is your same weeded mash bill. This is just a single barrel. And I'll tell you what, right now, the nose on this one's a little spicier. Do you get that, Mike?

This isn't the blue corn, so this is yellow corn.

This is yellow corn, but the nose on it's a little spicier.

Oh yeah.

And when I taste it, it's got a very caramel-y, butterscotch-y kind of mouth-coating feel to it.

And that's... Got that baking spice a little bit on the back end. Maybe some nutmeg.

And the oils are just...

Okay, so that's the big difference. So if you look at the... It's like a wine. If you look at it, I mean, look at the legs on it, because the corn oil, whatever's left of the corn oil has not been filtered out. I mean, we never charcoal filter anything, mainly because we couldn't figure it out. And then we spun it into, we don't charcoal filter, but we couldn't figure it out to prevent it from making the product too dark.

And then what do businessmen do? They take a weakness and turn it into a strength, right?

Yeah. I think if our listeners are out on the bourbon trail, you should definitely come by here and pour yourself a bottle of bourbon. Whether you're a weeded bourbon guy or not, this stuff is awesome.

So this to me is an exceptional pour for a younger bourbon. I mean, how old is this now? Probably two and a half to three years? Yeah. Yeah. So for a younger bourbon, this is an exceptional pour. And I tell you what's getting me, what's getting me is that mouth feeling it finish on it. That finish is really, it's got a strong finish.

What do you think Mike? I'm over here in heaven. We're drinking weighted bourbon. I mean, how much better does it get?

So this means this came out, this, the number on this bottle tells you that it came out towards the end of the barrel. So it's going to be sweeter. It's going to have more caramel, more barrel. Influence on it.

Yeah. More of that Kentucky love. That's right.

At the end, the bottles are so dark that, you know, I don't know that I would buy one, but I've filtered them through a coffee filter for people before. You know, people were just like, no, that's what I want. It looks so dark in there. It was like raining charcoal. I said, look, I can't let you leave with that, you know, but we'll, we'll filter. We'll go get some coffee filters in the back. And so, um, but yeah, it's that, I'm sure that bottle, you can see some charcoal on the bottle on the bottom.

No, she did. She did a pretty, she did a pretty good job. Um, And you got a great staff here. You know, we walked in here and she greets us the door and then you go in the back and you see your head distillery. The steel's rubbing right now as we're in here. And I love to see that, you know, when you walk into distillery, especially a craft or artists in distillery and they're in there just working away, trying to make some money.

Yeah. Oh, I love to see that too.

Yeah, and she set us up in this barrel room here. I think this is a good spot for an interview. It really sets the mood, doesn't it? Oh, man. And she didn't have to bring chairs. I'd have been happy to sit on a barrel. It'd have been all right, I think.

They do a great job. I mean, they are all really skilled professionals. And Maggie is, we've worked with UK for years. We first started working with the chemical engineering program. And they were the majority of our labor. We would pay them for part time, and then they would get credit. And I mean, they were in here experimenting with different kinds of grains, cracked corn, flaked corn. We were getting flaked corn from Pennsylvania at one point. And we still have UK students. We have a chemical engineer that works in the evenings. No, he's a mechanical engineer and he distills at night and mashes at night. And then we have two people during the day that are marketing people. And then obviously He is not a UK student, but he's running this, well, obviously he's not a UK student. He's older than being in college, but he's running the still now. But it couldn't work without all of them.

He's a giant of a man too. He is a giant. He'd probably pick up one of these barrels by himself.

Yeah, he's like Gabe Lincoln.

Well, gentlemen, why don't we keep sipping on this bourbon and we'll take a little break here. And when we come back, you've got a couple more things for us to try, right? Yeah. Looking forward to it. We would like to thank Tommy and Gwen Mitchell from Loghead's Home Center for supporting this episode of the Bourbon Road. Loghead's Home Center, nestled in the hills of Kentucky, is an industry leader in building handcrafted rustic furniture. Family owned and operated, they take pride in offering only the very best for their customers. The Logheads, and that's what they like to call themselves, are skilled wood crafters who are passionate about creating rustic furniture for people who appreciate the beauty of natural wood. Owners Tommy and Gwen don't just sell the rustic lifestyle, they live it. And you can be sure that Loghead's furniture will always be handcrafted in Kentucky by artisans who embrace the simple way of life. Loghead's rustic furniture is made from northern white cedar, a sustainable wood that's naturally rot and termite resistant. Its beauty and quality will add warmth to your earthy lifestyle for generations to come. Be sure to check out everything they have to offer at LogHeadsHomeCenter.com. And while you're at it, give Tommy and Gwen a shout on Facebook or Instagram at LogHeadsHomeCenter.

All right, we are back. And what do you have for our second pour today?

So our second pour is our high rye bourbon, and this is 75% yellow corn, 21% rye, and 4% malted barley. So this is 100 proof. This one that we're tasting is probably, it's between a three and a four year old barrel. And this is the ride bourbon bill that we use now. And because we have three different mash bills, we basically run in cycles. So we'll run a year doing one or about a year, a year running another, and then a year running another. And so it's kind of funky keeping up with products. So the distributors will call and say, do you have this? And we'll say, well, actually, we don't. We've got this now. Now we're catching up. But the size still that we have, that's just going to be a problem until we're able to basically produce five to one or more. When you're doing that, then the wood's a problem because you're putting out so much to barrel. We don't have any more high-rider cells, so we don't have a high-ride barrel on the growler. it still is in some, some retailers. Um, but after we try this, then we'll, then we'll try the, the bottled in bond high ride that's coming out in March, probably.

And, and you actually said this is probably the last bottle in the building, right? That we're trying right now.

Last bottle that we have.

Yeah. All right. Well let's check it out. And that's, that's Werther's original on the nose, isn't it?

Yeah, I'd say it is. Butterscotch, Werther's.

That's got a great nose. It's definitely a ride bourbon. You said this is a hundred proof. Wow. We sure don't pick it up on the nose. Do you very rich and mellow? It's got a rich butterscotch flavor, but there's no, there's no ethanol to it.

It's your bourbon your way, right? That's right. I think it, uh, I already tasted it. You know me, I'm already already into it. Jim, um, for a ride, it's pretty good. It's got a little spice on that, just a little bit of spice on the back end.

Oh, you, it's got a, uh, it's got a pretty good mouth feel to it. It gets you down on the sides of the tongue a little bit and then it brings that spice to the back end. but it's not overpowering. You said this is 25% rye, no, 20% rye. So that's a pretty good amount of rye in there. You can pick it up, but I don't know that it tastes like it's 20% rye.

It tastes a lot different than the weeded mash bill that's the same. It's not as sweet. Oh, definitely not as sweet. It's dry. I don't know that people use that term with bourbons, but I certainly think of a rye bourbon I think of a rye bourbon as a dry bourbon. I mean, it dries your mouth out. It's spicier. I mean, I can certainly taste clove in this and all rye bourbons. And rye bourbons just, they carry the heat a little bit more. And some people want that as opposed to people who want a weeded bourbon. You know, we have people who come in who just say, oh, I don't want a weeded bourbon. They're too sweet. I mean, I don't want anything close to it. And then we have people who really like the high rye product. We frankly made the weeded bourbon and really thought we were gonna go that direction. And people were like, no, no, no. And so when you sell them on the rack, I'm always surprised that most months people, when we have them both up there, people buy more of the high rye than they buy the weeded.

After doing a tasting. Yeah. Yeah. Because they're- I can see that. They just, you know, they're- Well, this has got a little bit more, I mean, if you're looking for a little bit darker fruit, you know, and it's not real floral upfront, but when it hits that mid palette, you get the little bit of cherry, a little bit of apple plum kind of in the middle. But I don't know that I would consider this very dry. I mean, a little bit, but I'm not getting any tannins, you know, that add to that. It's kind of, if there's a little bit of dryness due to the lack of sweetness, Yeah, a little bit. This is a good high ride bourbon. This is really, really good.

And the age is somewhere between three and four years.

Yeah.

Three to four. So Sam, besides, you know, distillery, you guys do a lot for charity here at the distillery too. Can you tell us a little bit about that?

Well, we have a fun program that we call the charity barrel program. And we, we let a charity pick a barrel basically every month and the charity brings out a team and they, they like tomorrow we're doing the epilepsy foundation and they'll pick the barrel and then we'll sell the product through the internet and through the distillery in, um, and we'll give them $20 a bottle. So, um, For most of these barrels, it's a single barrel product and they get about 200 to 220 bottles out of it. And then we give them 10% of all the other sales on the release date. So they'll get between 45 and $5,000. And I personally do not have the ability to give $5,000 a month to charity. And I just think it's a really fabulous thing and people really love it. Then they get the barrel and they auction the barrel so they can get $500 or $1,000 for the barrel. And then they get a barrel head and they auction the barrel head. And, you know, I don't know how much they get for those, but then they also auction the opportunity to be, some do when they have, you know, kind of auctions, the opportunity to be on the tasting team. And so the Epilepsy Foundation raised $1,000 just by virtue of, you know, the opportunity to be on their tasting team. So, you know, this barrel program can be $7,000 to them and it's unique in that typically when they put on a fundraiser, they're putting up money to do it. And with this, it's not. And the Kentucky ABC came out with a ruling that said distilleries can do their own private selects. And so that sort of opened up the concept so that we can do it. And we offer the bottles through distribution if anybody wants them. as well. And so it's just, it's been a really fantastic thing. And, you know, really we love it. Like the Habitat for Humanity is coming up in April and Camp Horson around and Habitat We have to basically use the same label because it has a cola, but the Humane Society is in March. And so on the Humane Society label, they have a footprint kind of behind the jockey silk, which is really cool, you know? And so on that day, on their release day, they typically sell whatever bottles are left and they have kind of an event and we let the charities decide what they want to do. And we just say, you know, we'll open up that day early for you all if you want. And they come in. But on that day, in particular, on March 7th, the Humane Society will be here and they'll have a bunch of dogs and cats. And I'm a dog lover and had a lab who really changed my life. And when I was moving around a lot with that company, he was with me everywhere I went. And slept in the bed and in the car and everywhere else. And so we're really excited about that. And Clean is a local charity that goes and takes food that's not been used and distributes to needy people. So it's really fantastic. It's such good work. We say that it's one circumstance when too much bourbon is a good thing. Yeah.

So I saw some bottles out there sitting on the barrels at Ronald McDonald House. So the Ronald McDonald's house, did you mention that earlier, Ronald?

I could have, I don't know. That was, yeah, that was November and they sold 220 bottles. So, I mean, it was just great. And this stuff is done through the internet. And then we did St. Peter and Paul Catholic School. And they sold out too. And Christ the King is this weekend. And so, you know, it's just really neat.

That's great.

That's really awesome.

I think that's awesome that a craft of silderies, you're putting that much love into your community and, you know, it's nice to give back.

Yeah. Well, West 6th, you know, we're in the West 6th building and They're older than we are, they're a brewery, and they have really given a lot to this community. And this building in particular has changed this part of town radically. And so, you know, they've been a good example to follow. You know, what's watching the good works they're doing and seeing how it's really changed people in the community and how that business is perceived and really how the employees feel about it. I think our employees just love it. Oh, sure. They're just like, you know, these guys that they could, they could keep every dollar, but they're not.

So how to, so when somebody comes here to visit, you got West six right next door, right? And you got a restaurant in between you. Um, Jim actually got some food from there.

That a shrimp po' boy shrimp po' boy.

Yeah. So somebody can come on the distillery tour, right? On the Kentucky distillers association, the bourbon trail, they could stop by here, buy some bourbon, go over to West six, get some beer and probably even have a, um, bourbon beer over there, I think. Yeah. And then grab some food. Yeah. That's a,

Yeah, I mean, you're not always drinking Birdham. Maybe you're always drinking Birdham. A good beer is also good, right?

Yeah, on a hot summer day, for sure.

Absolutely.

At West Six, do they sell any of your guys' stuff over there? They just mainly beer?

Well, no, they can't sell packaged anything other than their own stuff.

Okay. But no cocktails or nothing over there.

No, they can't. I don't even think they have that license. They just have a beer license, a beer.

And then you got the food, food.

What's that food place called? Food chain. Oh no. Smith town. And then food chain is a nonprofit that's in between us. It's a food kitchen that, um, they teach people in the community how to cook and they're kind of helping them develop a career. And that's one of the owner's wife's Becca self runs that. And then this year she actually did a, uh, A cake made out of local squash that I think they got mostly from Glean. Um, and it was like a really good cinnamon little mini butt cake. And, um, so, you know, they, they released that. So that's a nonprofit. Um, and so, you know, there's just a lot of really cool stuff going on in this building. They do yoga out in the park one day a week, and then they, they have a West six running group.

Now does West six finish some of the beers in your barrels? No, they do not. They approached you.

Not really. They, uh, I think they typically use Pappy barrels. It's tough to compete with Pappy.

I think the whole world knows that, right? Well, you know what?

I always say that.

If I'm getting beat by Pappy, I can handle it. You can handle that? Yeah.

But this is what I say to people, right? I had a lot of people tell me, I do not like weeded bourbon. And I'll probably say this every episode, but I bet I could put a bad old Pappy in front of almost everybody and they're going to say, I'll drink that. I'm like, you like weeded bourbon then? Yeah. So why not try some of this other weeded bourbon that's out there? give it a shot. It might be just as good. It could be similar.

It's going to be in the same class. Typically when, what I find, um, with people is that I ask them what they like and they'll tell me three or four bourbons and it's a class. It's either a weeded bourbon or a ride bourbon. They just don't know it. They don't know. They think they like a particular, brand or you know they like Elijah Craig or they like Knob Creek or it's the age well it's not necessarily it's usually not the age it's usually the bill and the secondary grain.

I, me and Jim would probably both agree with you that that is it. It's the grain and how, what kind of love when that the barrel, where the barrel is, you know, how old is that barrel? Um, it could be all kinds of, it's a whole combination of things.

They call it a flavoring grain for a reason. Yeah.

Yeah. But I've had. I'm not a rye guy, but I've had several ryes that I love. You know, I got several rye bourbons at my house that I like to sip on every once in a while. It's a nice change, but nobody could convince me not to drink a weeded bourbon.

So you guys, so I asked you about if somebody uses your barrels to finish, but you actually do a finished bourbon, right?

Well, other people do use them, though. Oh, they do. Yeah. And so so pivot cider, the cidery here in town, they use them. And then we have a and then so we call it the Brothers in Fermentation program. So we loan them the barrels. They don't have to buy them. And then they send them back. after they put the cider in it and then we finish in it. And then we did the same thing with Blue Stallion, which is down the street. And we'll probably release that bourbon here, you know, soon. What we learned about that product is, is the finished products is, is you gotta move them really quickly. So like, you know, we'll use a straight product, but if we leave it in the barrel for, when we're finishing it for more than three or four months, it'll just overtake whatever else is. So you've got to be watching that almost weekly, right? Yeah, we do. And so the cider, it's not like it becomes a cider. You know, it still has the heart of a bourbon and bourbon is by far the dominant spirit, but it has a sort of an apple nose to it. And we don't know about the Blue Stallion cause it hadn't come out yet, but we would, we would like to start doing, um, that with all the local breweries in town. Um, and we're going to put some taps in here and we're going to put on tap as the people we're working with and obviously West six because, you know, they've been so good to us and, you know, they are kin essentially. So, um, but yeah, so soon we'll probably have three, three tabs, a Blue Stallion and then the cider and then the, the West six guys.

So they take they take your bourbon barrels after you dump them and then they put cider in them and they finish their cider and bourbon barrels, send the barrels back to you. Yep. And that's almost an Alabama style whiskey, isn't it? I mean, they do they do apple peels, I think, don't they down there? I think they do. They do. What do they do? Apple peels in the barrel.

In a bourbon barrel?

Yeah, I think it's I think that's what they call an Alabama style whiskey. I thought was was Apple peels. I may have to go back and check that, but I'll tell you what, if somebody will tell us on the episode, Hey, you guys are wrong. We don't get away with anything.

Yeah, I'm sure. Yeah. I know. I know.

I guarantee we got listeners in Alabama and they're probably one of these guys. They have no idea what they're talking about.

So Sam, what do you got for us next?

Next we have Our bottled and bond high ride that's coming out in March. No, I still don't have the label approved yet and it got rejected once, but I think I've got it all figured out. And so it's our product. It's an 80-20 mash bill. So it's 80% yellow corn, 20% rye. It's some of the earliest stuff we made. So the mash bill of what we're currently drinking is small. So you've tweaked the mash bill a little bit. Yeah, we tweaked it a little bit. And we made everything the same. We went to 75, 21, four on everything. And we're really proud of it because we feel like to be a craft distillery and to be producing a four-year product, um, is fantastic. And it is really good. And so, um, it's dark and it, um, I think it has a great nose on it. Of course, we just pulled it right out of the barrel. The three of us.

This is a bottle and bond. So it will ship at a hundred proof, but you pull it out of a barrel that was marked 117 proof.

Uh, yeah.

Now down to paint that picture for all of our listeners. Sam actually took a barrel from in here where we're sitting at and you'll see those photos of, of where we're sitting at. If you look on, on our website, flipped it over, pulled the bung out, got a whiskey thief, got it, got us some bourbon straight from the barrel. And man,

And then were you impressed by that? I love it.

I was impressed that you could flip this thing over.

I wanted to snatch it from you and just flip it.

You can do it next. But then he uprighted the barrel and that's, that's the hard part, right? That's the hard part. Yeah.

So I'll be laid up for a week. It was worth it though for you guys. That's great.

Well, we have in our glass your bottle and bond bourbon, your high-ride bottle and bond bourbon, which is releasing in March of this year. So a couple of months from now, this will be on the shelves. I'm excited. Breaking news right there. Yeah.

And this will be a limited edition because this is the only time it'll be this mash bill. So I have to change the cola around for the next one.

Um, and then it'll stay that, that cola and you keep saying cola. So our far listeners that don't know what that is. Oh, okay. Yeah.

What certificate of label approval. So when you go to do anything, you have to state the class. And they've really tightened this up. So like, for example, the statute says that if it's aged less than four years, then you got to put the age on it.

And months or whatever.

Yeah. And so, or at least, you know, at least. And so what was happening is in the you know, once sort of the craft thing took off, people were putting out things that didn't have an age date. And, you know, the TTB was basically assuming it was four year old because it was straight. You know, they just assumed it was at least four. So you put straight and I think people were thinking of it didn't have an age statement. It was four years, but that wasn't necessarily the case. So the TTB has really ratcheted up how they're looking at things. And in particular, high rye, I submitted this label and they said, well, you know, you got to state the mash bill because it says high ride. And I said, I can't find that anywhere. I can't find that any regulation. I can't find it in an internal memo. I can't find anywhere. And, you know, that's losing battle. Yeah. You know, I mean, so you're like, we don't care. So they had it somewhere and I said, okay, that sounds great. I want to be absolutely transparent. So we changed it around and put the mash bill on it. And, um, uh, And so it, but I think that every label really has to be, you put some creativity into it. So in our labels, we state how we started and why we use a jockey silk and because it's, we believe it's the, the icon of Kentucky. And although a lot of people think this is a traffic guard.

I think some of our listeners, we got a guy out in Australia, Jacob Bell, he'll appreciate that knowledge about what a coal is. And Jason Waller from South Carolina, they both like the history and the ins and outs of that stuff. And they're always hitting us up in our private, we got a private Facebook group called Roadies and they're always hitting us up about questions and they just love that, just that inside knowledge.

Well, I think that's the case. And so when we write these labels, when I write the back, I try to explain what's going on. So the cola for the bottled in bond explains the Bottled in Bond Act of 1897 and why they enacted it. It was enacted because basically the distillers were in this sort of battle with the, with the rectifiers and they said, we want to be known. And we don't want to, you know, if you know, we think blended bourbon is lesser. And of course the rectifiers said, well, we think blended bourbon is greater. And, uh, the distillers, at least at that point, you know, won their little battle and got to come up with something that is, is, that is an unblended spirit. So, um, so I wrote that up in the bottled in bond part and it has, you know, it's basically takes up the whole back label.

That's great. Well, hopefully it'll get approved this time and you'll be on your way. I think it will. All right. Well, I tell you what, uh, this one is definitely, It's a sibling of the other one, but it's different.

It's definitely different.

I think it's interesting that these really high proof products, when they're unfiltered, There is something as smooth as something that's 90 proof.

Oh, you need a barrel proof version of this. This is really good. I haven't tasted it proofed down to 100. I'm sure it's going to be wonderful. But drinking it barrel proofs, it's a treat. Oh, thanks. So what do you all smell and taste? So I'm still getting a butterscotch on this, no doubt about it. Butterscotch is still coming through. I guess that raisin, but you get that musty that when I say must, I don't mean corn must. I mean warehouse must like age. I'm getting this, uh, this older bourbon nose to it and this older bourbon taste, but definitely, um, raisin, Mike raisin, plum, um, fig,

Yeah. I'd get that. That, uh, what's that? Uh, Fig Newton. Yeah.

Fig new, a little bit of molasses.

Well, the alcohol as a solvent has certainly had time to break down more of the cellulose and the lignin in the wood. So I think you gain more of that. And then you also, as you get a greater air gap, which is eulage, we don't use it in this industry, but they use it in the wine industry. Now they hate eulage because it sours their wine, turns it into vinegar, but I frankly love eulage. No, there is a point of diminishing marginal returns. Once the eulage is 50% of your barrel, It's hard to recover that in a bottle price, at least for craft people because we're sort of on the upper end. Now we have always tried to stay in, we've tried to stay in the middle of the shelf. Like we've priced it to our wholesaler so that it hits the shelves in the mid thirties. Um, now when they buy a barrel picks, I don't know what they do with their, you know, they, they probably sold it to you for more expensive than that. But, uh, you know, on our, on our normal stuff, that was a business decision we made.

I'm getting a little bit of fennel seed anise on it. Um, man, it's, it's, it's actually quite complex on the back, on the back end, on the tail end.

It's very complex. Not as much spice on that back end as I thought it would be. Not as much as that burn.

But, you know, in the year's age difference between what we tasted just a moment ago and this one, I'm getting more of the barrel tannin in it. Just a little bit more, I think, because I'm getting that dryness in the back of my mouth from it. There's no bitterness there, though. Not at all.

I think the corniness is gone. Yeah, there's almost no corn to it. There's corn, but nothing that would put you off.

Sam, what can we see from the future? Where is bluegrass distillers going?

Well, I think we're going to go, location is a big thing for us. We like to share the bourbon experience with people. And we intend to move to a farm setting and do almost like an orchard field, like an orchard field. So we would have acreage and barrel houses maybe. a venue where people can come and stay. Um, and we might have more food there. We'll probably have food. Um, and so we'll, we'll do that. Um, we're just going to kind of keep doing what we're doing. We're going to do it in a greater scale. Um, we've got, we're going to be buying a much bigger still. At this point, we're really committed to the pot still product. Um, we like that we can change the flavor by basically cutting off the tails at a certain level and, you know, redistilling a couple times. And we feel like it keeps some of the heavier compounds. And it's a way that we can kind of distinguish our product. So, um, you know, we'll do that. I think, I hope that our charity works continue and, and, and that people can use our new venue to do things for their charities that we can't do here because we don't have the space. I think the other thing we bluegrass distillers in addition to the other distilleries will do is that although I love bourbon, I hate intoxication. So I think that, um, people good bourbon encourages people to be really responsible about what they're doing because they're buying something that They're appreciating. It slows you down a little bit. It slows you down. Yeah. And so I think that bourbon people have a different appreciation for it. And through the KDA, we get to work with, well, Jim Beam is sort of who is leading this alcohol responsibility thing. And I really enjoy working with the leadership of Beam to work on that. you know, we'll continue to do that. And we also like working with UK and the other universities here and developing young distillers and young tourism people. And so unlike my day job, which is practicing law, which I do like, you know, I like representing people and helping people and helping them get through their crises. In this business, we work with a lot of different people with a lot of different skill sets at a lot of different places in their lives. And that's really awesome. So to the extent that we can continue to cultivate new distillers or new tourism people and help them go on to another place or be able to put food on their family's table and be a positive influence in the areas where we are, that's what we're going to do. We want to be kind of the common denominator of good in what we're doing.

What about your, your, your bourbon, you're going to get a little older and older as the time goes on or.

So yeah. Um, we are going to continue to get older and older and, um, the blue corn. One of the major reasons why we're going to move out of town is because we want to grow our own corn. We were contract growing before we used somebody else's land. So we'll control it, we'll control the products, and we'll probably grow yellow corn too. So that's one thing that we will be doing is we're going to be going from grain to glass. We probably won't do wheat or rye or certainly not barley because Kentucky is not a great place to grow barley. Although there are people doing it and if they could really get it going here, we would certainly buy a local product. That's sort of the main thing. We're going to control our ingredients more. If we can find a place that has access to the aquifer and it's not sulfur water, we will use the spring water. And so that's one of the things that is on our checklist that, you know, when we're looking at property, like we're going to drill. And we kind of came up with that when we were looking at this one property. And the guy said, hey, that pumps out 18,000 gallons of water a day. And it all tastes great. So we kind of added that to our want list. And then we're going to continue with these three lines, have older stuff. And we're going to continue to play around with finishing products. And there's one that we think is really fun that we can't really tell you about yet. But hopefully, y'all will come back. It should be, you know, it's definitely thinking outside the barrel.

We always like to come back. So, yeah. Yeah. We want to have you back. So we have tasted four of your products today and one of them, actually two of them have yet to release. So that's kind of special for us, right? I'm just going to say it right now. Everybody be on the lookout for this bottle and bond. It's something else. It's really good and I think it's special I think it's gonna be appreciated at large by the people who try it and Why don't you take a minute and tell everybody how they can find you on the internet and social media Just give your plug. How do people find you? you know, set up a time to come see a tour and taste your product.

Well, they can find us at www.bluegrassastillers.com and then they can log on a tour right there. They can come in tours are $5 and get a tasting or tastings are just free if you don't want to do a tour. And then we're in liquor stores around in Kentucky or in Tennessee. We will be in Mississippi. We can ship to Virginia and Wyoming. through their state stores. So I mean, if you have the number, um, and then we are with a big distributor now in Georgia. And so, um, in 2020, we should be shipping to Georgia, which is really cool because I consider that, you know, Atlanta, my second. Sure.

Absolutely. And you're looking at new States as, as, um, availability of product permits.

It's a real challenge, you know, just keeping up with the paperwork at this point. So, um, it would have to be, If a really big distributor wanted to take us in another state, we would have to really think about it because we do, we are in this situation where to keep, um, you know, really quality product. I remember when I was hoping that our product was getting to be a year, you know, and I was like, gosh, if we could, we just going to put out Kentucky Bourbons. And then, you know, Kentucky's got to be a year. And so and then and then I remember thinking, oh, we're just going to put out straight products. And now I'm thinking, I don't want to put anything out that's less than three years. And, you know, probably in two years, I'll think I don't want to put anything out that's that's, you know, less than four years. And, you know, so those are just sort of like, the growing pains you go through when you're like, are level. It's easier to say yes, but when you say yes, you're kind of robbing yourself of that future product.

Well, as we tasted through your products today, we got to taste your bourbons in the two-year range, in the three-year range, and then, of course, your bottle and bond four-year. And at each step, you can taste how it's maturing and coming along. But they're all beautiful. They all taste good. I mean, you can certainly get more corn in the beginning, and then that corn sort of disappears towards the end. But even as a young bourbon, it's very flavorful. There's a lot going on there. And I think you've done a great job. Thank you. Really good. I really enjoyed it. Mike?

Man, I think this will be a good episode. Give a shout out to all of our listeners out there. Like us on Facebook. Tell your friends like us if they're bourbon drinkers. Like us on Facebook. Follow us on Instagram. We're out there. We also have, as I mentioned earlier, a private group. on Facebook called the Bourbon Roadies. Go in there and request to be liked. There's only three questions to answer. Me or Jim are the ones that approve it, nobody else. And we got some great conversation in there, some stuff we don't talk about on the episodes or on our Facebook page or on our deal. And you can just see us out there and look for 2020. We're going to be out in the public a little bit more.

Yeah, looking forward to it, Mike.

Sam, hey, I just want to say thank you and your staff were awesome.

Thank you. We really appreciate y'all coming by. This has been great. Made the interview really easy and it's fun to drink some bourbon with some new friends. It's always fun to drink bourbon with new friends, isn't it?

It is. Well, thanks again. We really appreciate it. Thank you. Thanks. We do appreciate all of our listeners and we'd like to thank you for taking time out of your day to hang out with us here on the Bourbon Road. We hope you enjoyed today's show and if so, we would appreciate if you'd subscribe and rate us a five star with a review on iTunes. Make sure you follow us on Facebook, Twitter, and Instagram at The Bourbon Road. That way you'll be kept in the loop on all the Bourbon Road happenings. You can also visit our website at thebourbonroad.com to read our blog, listen to the show, or reach out to us directly. We always welcome comments or suggestions, and if you have an idea for a particular guest or topic, be sure to let us know. And again, thanks for hanging out with us.