397. Southern Distilling with Vienna Barger

Welcome to another great episode of the Bourbon Road with your host, Jim O'Brien, where they talk bourbon and of course, drink bourbon. Grab yourself a pour, kick back and enjoy another trip down the Bourbon Road.

We're very excited to have Blanton's bourbon shop.com as a new sponsor for the bourbon road podcast. In fact, this podcast is brought to you by Blanton's bourbon shop. Blanton's bourbon shop.com is the only official merchandiser for Blanton's original single barrel. Looking for a unique gift? Blanton's bourbon shop has got you covered. Blanton's bourbon shop.com is your home for all Blanton's gifts. The Bourbon Road is excited to have pintsandbarrels.com as a sponsor of this episode as well as our official custom apparel provider. Be sure to check out pintsandbarrels.com and browse their ultimate online store for bourbon lovers. Hello, listeners, and welcome back to another episode of the Bourbon Road Podcast. I'm your host, Jim Shannon, and today we are very blessed to have a great new company in the house, a great new guest, somebody who has not been on the show yet, but somebody who has some award-winning whiskeys that we're gonna get to taste through today and get to enjoy and find out all about. This may be one of the very few North Carolina distilleries we've had on the show so far. But let's welcome Vienna Barger to the show. Vienna, welcome to the bourbon road.

Thank you. Delighted to be here.

Well, you guys were gracious enough to send us some samples of some of your whiskeys. And we're going to take a look at at least two of those today. And we've got both a bourbon, a bottled and bon bourbon, and we've got your double rye, which we'll have in the second half. And I guess what I'd like to say is let's not waste a whole lot of time here. Let's get straight to that first pour. And as we're sipping on whiskey, we can talk all about Southern Distilling. Sound good?

It sounds wonderful.

All right, so what we have in our glass here is your Southern Star Paragon Bottled in Bond Bourbon. Can you tell us a little bit about this whiskey before we take our first sip?

Absolutely. So Paragon, our Southern Star Paragon is a weeded bourbon. The weeded bourbon was the very first distillate that we made and barreled at Southern Distilling Company starting back in 2017. And the reason we decided to go with a weeded bourbon, A, I guess, were risk takers at the time. weren't a lot of weeded bourbons on the market. So we had our fingers crossed that it was going to grow in popularity. But secondly, Makers Mark also makes a weeded bourbon. It was one of the favorites for myself and for my husband Pete. So we decided, as we do in a lot of things, why not make something that we already know that we like and see how we can do it right here in North Carolina. So we have two expressions of that Southern Star Paragon in the market and the bottled in bond is 100 proof bottled in bond. All that whiskey was at least four years old and came from a single season at our distillery. And it is as being very well received out in the marketplace and by whiskey reviewers.

Well, as I bring it to my nose, I will confirm that, you know, that's kind of a, what do they say, a hard row to hoe to choose both a bottle and bond and a weeded bourbon to go together early on. That's kind of a, that's a big ask because weeded bourbons typically, typically take longer to mature than do rye bourbons. And a bottle and bond, you've got no choice but to hit four years, right?

Yep. Most of the paragon that's going into bottles is going to be over five. We taste our bourbons as we go along as they're waiting in those barrels and aging. And weighted bourbon tends to, you know, we knew at six months we had done OK, because at six months it had a really nice flavor to it. Obviously, we knew we were going to leave it in the barrel for longer. And I have to say, when we pulled it out at around two, I was like, wow, that's going to take some time because it develops that really grassy character when it's on the young side. But we were delighted at where it was coming out at four years of age. We barrel at a lower barrel proof than some other distilleries in the industry. So we're putting things in barrels at typically at 110. And that gives us an advantage of not having to dilute terribly much when we take it to the bottle, particularly that bottle and bond at 100 proof.

You also get the added solubility of the water in the barrel, right? I mean, at the lower proof, you've got more water and that tends to attack the wood sugars a little bit easier. Yeah.

We find it makes a significant difference for us. So our aging climate is very similar to what folks experience over in Kentucky, where we've got so many barrels of urban aging. We're about 850 feet above sea level. We have nice, warm, hot summers in North Carolina, but we've also got fantastic humidity. So we are very happy with where we land out on angel share loss, no more than anyone else with our climate. And we've got shorter winters. So we get cold enough to get that rest in the barrel and have the whiskey move in and out of the wood, but it doesn't stay cold for terribly long. So that dormancy period is pretty short.

But it has a really delightful nose to it. I would say it's not soft. It does not have like that right bite that you get from a ripe bourbon whiskey. It is very floral though, surprisingly so. But I'm getting like, in addition to those floral notes, I'm kind of getting some, almost like a plum jam or something. It's kind of jammy a little bit, which is nice. I like that. Not a lot of ethanol on it. I mean, literally, it is a very appealing nose, very traditional bourbon, but you've got something else going on in there that's a little unique to your profile, I think. Well, cheers.

Absolutely. Salud. When people ask me for a tasty note or a descriptor on Paragon, I find I end up keeping it very simple. I usually say it's pleasing. or it's lovely. And that's just how it's always struck me from the beginning. It's it's just very enjoyable and pleasing without a lot of excitement, I guess.

Yeah, I think keeping it simple is important. I like to call out a few notes because it kind of helps me to solidify a profile in my mind for a particular brand or a particular expression from a brand. Sometimes you'll see a profile carry across multiple expressions and you say, well, that's really typical of this particular maker. They had this really wonderful plum note or whatever it might be, but this does not come across super soft on the front of the palette. Like you might get with another weeded with other well-known weeded bourbons. This one has a little bit more, um, a little bit more barrel spice to it. I like that. Um, I don't know if you've heard that before, but I'm kind of getting it. It is my first bourbon of the day. So maybe a little bit of that has to do with my palette not being warmed up. But I go back to the nose and back to the palate, and it's such a wonderful dance between the two. They're very in unison, which is nice. I love that when that happens. So what were you shooting for with this? Were you shooting for a weekend sipper? Were you shooting for something that would be a little bit more of a daily pour? I mean, what was your target audience for the bottle and bon bourbon?

So with our paragon weeded, the goal really sits in the name. So we really wanted this to be the exemplary product that we produced at Southern Distilling Company. We wanted it to be the model for what we wanted to aim for from there forward. So bold, I guess, to step out with what we hoped would be the best of the best from our place, but very happy with where it has ended up and the recognition that we're receiving for it so far.

So Paragon, if you look that word up in the dictionary, does it mean like peak or top of the heap or something like that?

Yeah, the example to set that you would like to measure up to.

The goal, the target.

Yeah, the exemplary. Yep.

Fantastic. Well, I have to say that I'm really enjoying this. This is an exceptional bonded bourbon. I'll say that. There are a lot of bottled and bond bourbons out there. Not as many as there could be, right?

And not very many weeded.

And not very many weeded. That's correct.

Very small number of weeded bottled and bond out in the market. So we're pleased to be able to offer that to our folks that really like those weeded bourbons. part of their sipping.

Well, even if you're not a weeded bourbon person, I would highly suggest they give this one a shot because this one does have that little bit of extra barrel spice that I kind of like. I kind of lean towards the spicier whiskeys and the Rye's. Everybody's got their own little avenue they like to go down when it comes to whiskey. Mine's on the spicier side. But when I can get a weeded bourbon that has a little oomph to it like this does, that's always nice. It still doesn't disappoint for somebody looking for a little bit softer palate. It's still nice in that respect.

Jim, how do you feel about the cast strength barrel strength versions? Do you like that higher proof?

I do, but I've found that, and it takes time because I think as you're entering into the whiskey area and you're sort of exploring, you have that tendency to slowly rise up the proof ladder over time to try and gain more and more flavor. And after a bit of time, you find out that there's still wonderful things in the 90 to 100 range as well. And I found that I prefer things in the 100 to 110 personally, but I could find wonderful surprises in the 90 to 100 range as well. So. And then extra extra high proof. So let's say anything over 110, 120 even. Um, I like them, but on more rare occasions, maybe because they can, they can burn your palate out pretty quick and you don't get to enjoy them for long before you have to set your glass down for the night. So why did you ask that question? Do you guys have something in particular that you're

Our second expression for that southern star paragon is our single barrels private selections. So the other offering in that in that Nashville the 70 corn 16 wheat 14 malted barley and with us barreling at 110 typically you're near that. as you're coming into the bottle. So we've got some that have come out 112, 113, and then we've had some that have ended up being a little bit lower over time. So it just depends on where they've been in the warehouse, but they are being very well received also. So.

Well, that's really good for you that you're finding that your whiskeys survive the maturing process at or around the original barrel entry proof. on average, because I know it depends on where it is in the warehouse, but that's a good thing. That's amazing. That's good for the wallet and it's good for the palette too. So that's really great. Thanks. So you've got a Southern Star, what is it? Something around a 90 proof bourbon as well.

We do have a high rye bourbon. So it's Southern Star bourbon. The weeded bourbon has a burgundy label on it and the regular high rye bourbon has kind of a cream colored label on it. Looks like parchment, aged parchment.

And then the higher barrel proof versions of the single barrel picks.

Correct. And we have the single barrel in both that weeded expression and in that high rye expression.

Can you share with our listeners the price range of those three different expressions? So we kind of know where your bourbons are priced at in the market. I know you have to kind of estimate because it probably varies.

Yeah, it does. It does vary. So for the high rye bourbon, around 50, 45 to 50, depending on the market. And then the weeded typically is $10 more. So it's going to be 60 for that. Bottled in bond. And then as we go up to those single-barrel selections is typically a $15 premium on the standard bottle price. So from 60 to 75.

So how did, how did Southern Distilling get started? How did you, Vienna and Pete enter into this venture?

That's a good question. So we knew we wanted to establish a family business. We both come from multi-generational family businesses, neither of which were continuing as we were looking for an opportunity in our married life together. And my husband Pete was a mechanical engineer by training, but he had come up through three different family-owned organizations after he completed his degree. and was very interested in seeing what we could do and what we could do to build our own business and to build a legacy for our family. So that's a high bar to set to set out on your own and establish something new. It took us a while. We spent about 10 years in due diligence really looking at different opportunities. tell folks we were almost a dock and dredge marine construction company instead of being Southern Distilling Company. So we looked at lots of different things, spent a little while looking at doing a vineyard in North Carolina and a winery. And At that point in time, Pete was buying Syrac vodka, which is made from grapes over in France. And he said, when we were out looking at our farmland where we were talking about having that vineyard, he said, well, if we're going to grow grapes, why don't we make vodka instead of making wine? And we started doing a lot of due diligence and research on craft distilling. At that point in time, there were less than 250 craft distilleries in the country. So it was just really starting. And I did that initial research. And I remember coming back to Pete and saying, it's going to hit. It's going to be big. We want to be in on the front end. We need to be open in a year. Let's go. And then we started spending a lot of time in Kentucky, spending a lot of time with distributors, other distilleries, doing more research and knowing that we wanted to establish a scalable beverage business. We slowed down a bit and took more time so that we could enter larger scale with a more significant build out than we had originally anticipated. So from one year, we went to three years, took us a little longer to get the doors open. A lot of the craft distillers we met along the way kept seeing us. A month would go by and, when are you going to open? Are you open yet? But it took us a little while. When we opened the doors, they understood why. Because rather than doing a small pot still in a small square footage location, we went big or as big as we could. We bootstrapped and did it with our own finances as well as some support from the SBA to get things started and went as large as we could in that space to get us started with our initial build. We purchased a building that was an empty shell and in the end of 2014 and started construction and opened to the public April of 2017 with a 30,000 square foot distillery.

That's big. That's a lot of square feet.

It is. We started initially with just producing five days a week, one shift. So it was a smaller amount of whiskey as we were getting started initially. But now with 24-7 production on our plant and the expansions that we've done over the last few years, we're at roughly 20,000 barrels of annual production.

That's a pretty good size.

Scaled through phase two and phase three and more to come.

What size still did you put in? So you put in a column still, and I'm assuming it's of a reasonable size.

We did. We started with an 18 inch Van Doorn column. And at the time, I think we were the third order for that size that was coming in. So we were entering the market at the same time as some of the other initial craft distillers that were trying to come in at that larger scale. And was really as we were in our, I guess, 2.5 phase of expansion that we realized we were outpacing our distillation capacity with our cooking and fermentation capacity. So we added another 14 inch column so we can operate them in tandem or separately. We've got the 18 inch and the 14 inch running together. Typically the way we're running these days, we run the same Nashville through all the firm owners typically for multiple days or multiple weeks at a time. So we run them both together and through a single doubler.

Did you say how many shifts you're running?

We're 24 seven now. So we're running around the clock. We take about five days off a year for maintenance and some holidays.

You only take five days of vacation a year? Oh my goodness, no. Actually, you've got some pretty comfortable people that let you get out of there, right?

No, our team members have vacation and they have holiday leave, but they rotate so the plant doesn't shut down very much. They don't like to turn on and off.

Exactly. Yeah, I was more or less talking about you owners. Do you owners get the chance to vacation just a little bit?

You know, it takes time as entrepreneurs and with a new business venture to get to that point. We are now a team of around 55 and really have been able to be fortunate enough to grow our executive team with some very talented and experienced new folks that have joined us within the last year to two years and that has been tremendous to know that we've got some additional experience and leadership that we can step away for a little while and know that things are in very good hands. But it takes a while to get there. For the early years, everybody was doing everything. It was a very small team and you had to be on call to manage anything that came up.

Well, let's try to put your production scale in terms that are easy for our listeners to wrap their brains around. You say 20,000 barrels a year. That's a lot, but that works out to about That's about 60 barrels a day. Is that right?

Correct.

Yeah. What's that like in terms of logistics? Is that like a semi truck of barrels showing up every three days and 12 people on staff and just constantly racking barrels and building rick houses? And what's it like?

Yeah, it's busy for sure. So we've got multiple grain deliveries coming in every day. We're very fortunate to have the ability to work with local farmers to bring in over 80% of the grain that we use in our production. So that corn and wheat that's grown locally is all come in from farms that are within 15 to 20 miles of the distillery. And that is something that's very, very important to us. It gives us an opportunity to practice regenerative agriculture practices with those farmers and also to know exactly what's going on in the fields and be able to specify our grain specifications to them before it ends up hitting our silos and going into our whiskeys. So that's happening all the time. Yes, 288 barrels per truckload show up. So we go through those in four to five days, and then we're bringing in another one. One thing that has happened as a result of really moving to that 24-7 production is breaking our production team into production and barrel warehousing. So we now have a dedicated team that manages barrel filling and then movement to one of the rick houses and controlling that environment, stacking all of those barrels and keeping track of our aging inventory. So that's been a shift in production for us. But yeah, there's always something going on. There's a forklift moving and people loading and unloading all the time.

Fantastic. Well, tell us a little bit about Statesville. First of all, where is it in relation to other larger areas that people might be aware of? And what kind of history does Statesville have within the whiskey world? You guys are killing it now. You've probably got a great acceptance from your local towns and counties and everything. But what's kind of the history of Statesville?

Sure, sure. Statesville is called Statesville because it essentially is the center of the state in North Carolina. And in the early days of our nation, the early days of the state, it was really the center of a lot of activity in North Carolina. frankly, nationally, I would say there is an area directly south of us that many people know called Charlotte and Charlotte is in Mecklenburg County. And Mecklenburg County actually has the notoriety recognition of having written one of the original versions of the Declaration of Independence. They called it the Mecklenburg Declaration before our country issued an official Declaration of Independence. So there's been always a lot of activity in the region. We're in the Piedmont area of North Carolina. So we're just down the mountain from Asheville and still rolling hills before you get to the coastal plain of the state. So about 45 minutes north of Charlotte, easy access from that big thriving metropolis now with over a million, actually say over a million people, but it's probably well over a million, a million and a half at this point in that Charlotte metro area. So significant population base for North Carolina, just south of us. But if we look way back to the origins of Statesville and the origins of whiskey distilling, there's really an untold history that we are now trying to tell in conjunction with our spirits and with our distillery located in Statesville. Statesville now is home to the crossroads of Interstate 40 and Interstate 77, but way back then, In the 1800s, it was the crossroads for the rail lines. So we had two major rail lines that intersected in Statesville. And at that point in time, there really were two ways to move goods. You could move them on the rail lines, or you could move them on the water on a barge or a boat. So having that transportation access combined with robust agriculture and immigrants that had come to the area, many of them with the knowledge and skills of distilling from their home countries, Statesville really became the center of spirits production for North Carolina and the center of shipping spirits production up to the New England area, up to the Ohio River Valley, and as far west as our early nation went at that point in time. So as a result of all of that activity, which really established the city and got a lot of thriving industry going right here. We had rectification houses that were in town, six major ones, that really were establishing a tremendous industry for the area. But that drew the attention of the Anti-Saloon League and the Temperance Movement, and they chose to focus their efforts on that statesville region, Piedmont region. So they were looking for, you know, essentially cutting the head off the snake. They went right to where it was all coming from and focused on that community. And they were very good at what they were trying to do. And as a result of all of those efforts in 1903, the citizens of the city of Statesville voted themselves dry. So they outlawed any alcohol production or consumption or sale in 1903, long before the rest of the country decided that prohibition was the way to go for a short period of time. As a result, all of those farm families, that was their livelihood. They really didn't have a whole lot of choice. They could completely stop, which would really damage the income that they had for their families. They could relocate if they had the means to and headed over to Kentucky and Tennessee, help keep those distilleries and industries to get established and enrolling. Or they kept doing it. They just kept doing it illicitly. And as a result of that robust legal industry that was happening back then, we now have the history of North Carolina that people do know about, which is moonshining and bootlegging and eventually NASCAR car racing as a result. But we wouldn't have had any of those things with all that fame and notoriety had we not had legal robust industry happening at all those farms to begin with.

Yeah, that's true. So true. I was going to say NASCAR and whiskey go hand in hand, but I think NASCAR and a lot of things go hand in hand. So, you know, it's such a popular sport and I'm sure a lot of our listeners know this, but both Tennessee and Kentucky, which are both well-known whiskey states were carved out of North Carolina in the late 1700s. So we were all one people at one time and we just sort of got carved out. So it only makes sense that North Carolina would have a whiskey history that's deep and rich if Tennessee and Kentucky both have deep and rich whiskey histories as well.

Yes.

All right, we're going to take a short break. I'm going to continue sipping on what's left of my glass of this Paragon Bottling Bond Bourbon. It is absolutely wonderful. It, in my opinion, is worth every penny of the $60 price tag, and I think people should give it a shot. When we come back from the break, we'll explore another expression of yours, and we'll talk about all kinds of things going on at Southern Distilling. Stick around, folks. Blanton's bourbon shop has got you covered. All of their handcrafted wood products are made in their in-house wood shop with authentic bourbon barrels. Specializing in barrel age potent treats, they use Blanton's barrels to age their own maple syrup, honey and coffee. Find the most unique gift ideas for your golf lover, cigar connoisseur, avid coffee drinker and Blanton's fan. Want to win an authentic Blanton's barrel head? Make sure you sign up for the giveaway on the home page of their website. Blanton's bourbon shop dot com is your home for all Blanton's gifts. If you're a bourbon drinker, and I bet you are if you're listening to this podcast, you need to head over to pintsandbarrels.com and check out the ultimate online store for bourbon lovers. Pints and Barrels Company was started by bourbon lovers for bourbon lovers. From spices to t-shirts, you'll find the perfect bourbon gift. Pints and Barrels proudly supports the bourbon road and invites you to visit pintsandbarrels.com. You need a custom apparel or swag for your bar, distillery, maybe even your bourbon society. They can do that too. As a matter of fact, they print our apparel. We're so happy with the quality and fast turnaround. Heightsandbarrels.com, the ultimate bourbon lovers gift shop and branding specialist. Alright folks, so we're back now. Ian and I had a nice little chit chat during off air time there. We continued to sip on the Southern Star Paragon bottled in Bon Bourbon. It is a wonderful weeded I think it's, you told me it was priced at $60. I think that's absolutely fair for something that's as craft as this is and as well constructed as this is. And it sits in a beautiful bottle. It's well done all the way around. I highly suggest our listeners give it a whirl. It's definitely worth it. It has also won quite a few awards, hasn't it?

Yes, yes, we were we're delighted. A few years back, actually, in 2022, we were recognized as the best overall bourbon in the single barrel category with best in class. And then when they pulled all the best in class bourbons together, we came through with that best overall bourbon for the New York World Wine Spirits competition. So that was phenomenal to have that recognition and to come out on top of all the bourbons in that competition for 2022. So since that time, there's been many more. I'm sure I will miss some because we've got a nice hefty list. I think that the most recent that were a delight for me were the two Platinum's for both the single barrel selection and the bottled and bond version of the Southern Star Paragon that we received from the Ascot Awards. So it's nice when we've got a highly respected competition that gives us one of those really strong recognitions. And that was wonderful to have that one. We had pulled another platinum that I think we're going to talk about here in a little bit with our double rye whiskey earlier. But it's really nice to have those weeded bourbons out there and to have as much love as we're receiving from those from the competitions that we're entering.

Speaking of your double rye, I do have a glass of it here. And I'm really looking forward to this rye. It's a sweet spot for me. I think I mentioned in the first half, I like things a little bit more on the spicier side. And trying something new that I've never had before always gets me excited. Trying something new that happens to be a rye really gets me excited. And so I'm really, I'm on the edge of my seat here. Can you tell me a little bit about this particular bottle?

I sure will. This is such a special product for us. And I think it's special for anyone that's picking up a rye whiskey, because I don't believe there's anything quite like it. So we go through several steps in putting double rye together. We distill two different types of rye mashvilles, one that's a very high rye, 95.5, and one that is just barely a rye whiskey at 51% rye, 39 on the corn, and then 10 on the malted barley. And then we combine those two. So you're getting all of the variety that comes in a rye whiskey packaged into one. And then because we're a bourbon distillery and we like making things accessible to everyone, we finish those rye whiskies in a freshly dumped paragon barrel till they're ready. So typically between six and twelve months that it's going to sit, pick up a little bit of that bourbon character from that ex bourbon barrel before we put it into the bottle. So it's different.

And how long do the individual ryes age in the barrel before they're combined?

Typically four years. So it's going to depend on what we have available and when we feel like it's ready, but it's typically four years.

Okay, which is really good for a rye whiskey. And then they get finished, they get mixed. Are the proportions relatively equal of the two?

That is at the discretion of our blender, my husband Pete Burger. So each release of Double Rye that we put together, he's going to be tasting as they go along and put that blend together and determine when it hits the taste profile that he's really wanting to see coming through.

Yeah, sometimes it's hard to arbitrarily pick a blend percentage or even sometimes a proof before you get a chance to taste it. But sometimes you're settling on a proof because you have labeling and everything to go with it. But certainly it's hard to predetermine percentages. You really need to blend to taste. And I think it's great that you guys do that.

Yeah.

And our proof on that is a little distinctive as well. And speaking to what you were saying, it wasn't random. We didn't just pick that because it was, you know, 88 and looked like a good number to put on a bottle. We actually took that finished product and proved it from 80 all the way through in two point increments up to 100 and then did a series of tastings to determine where we felt like it was going to shine the best. So that's where we ended up with that 88.

Well, the nose is extremely floral and dill forward, I will say. It's got a nice dill note to it and that's coming from that 95, I'm sure. But it's, it's still got a sweetness to it. It almost tastes like, tastes, it almost noses like, um, it's a bit older. Like it, it's, it's getting into that seven to eight year range where you start to get more candy like aspects on a rye. I'm kind of picking up those notes on the nose and I'm thinking, wow, this is, this is nosing older than it is. If it's around five years, I guess total barrel time. Yeah, this, this definitely comes across a little bit older than that. So rise do go through this wonderful transformation over their lifetime. Honey, definitely honey of sweetness. There's a honey sweetness on it and the dill. The cereal is not really strong on it. So it's not like real bready. It's kind of more, it's more light and aromatic. I really like it. It's very good. I'm looking forward to the taste. Cheers.

Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Be interested to hear what you think of. of the taste as well. Our other special aspect of Double Rye is that it is a partnership for us with a organization that is headquartered in Statesville called Purple Heart Homes. They have branches across the country, but we have had a partnership with them from the first bottling of Double Rye and share 50% of the profits from that product directly back to Purple Heart Homes. Their mission is to provide housing rehabilitation and customization to aging disabled veterans. So we're pleased to have that partnership. But when we when we bottled the first batch, we brought in a group of veterans that had had that relationship with Purple Heart Homes and the staff there as well. and taught them about the tasting wheel, taught them about flavors in whiskey, and asked them to help us with writing the tasting notes for that product. So it was really a treat to bring folks in that had not done that before and to hear the descriptors that they really were coming up with that were outside of normal things you would hear from people that do that all the time.

That's fantastic. I love the interactions that distilleries have with veterans and they have so much more to give. They definitely do. And, you know, we're a veteran run podcast and we have distilleries on all the time who are veteran owned. And there's so many more even that take it on their mission to invest in veterans and give them a bigger place in the sphere of whiskey operations. So that's great. Wow. I really, really super like this one. This is really good. I'm going to say this is definitely leaning heavier into like this fruity candy, candied fruit. sweeter, uh, rye. It's, it's got some peppery notes to it, but by the same token, I'm going to say it's more kind of a cooked fruit. I wish I could name what fruit it's not. It's like a, it's just like a general fruit term. I think it's, this definitely, definitely drinks much higher than five-year-old. This is, this is, this has entered that, that, that candy range for me a little bit.

Yeah, I think the fruit we often hear is fig, so a candied fig.

Yeah, candied fig. I could go for that. Actually, any fruit you said that was more darker, maybe stone fruit that was candied, I would go with it because it's very, very good. Exceptional rye whiskey. You said this one won a pretty big award too, right?

Yeah, a couple years back as well. I had platinum from Ascot Awards as well.

Fantastic. Yeah, this is really good. I'm going to guess that the 95.5 plays a bigger role in the mix, but maybe not. I don't know enough about blending to be able to truly say one way or another, but that deal hangs with it a little bit. It's wonderful. It's just really good. I'm wondering how much the effect that You can tell me, because you've probably tasted it both ways, how much effect did that ex bourbon barrel have on the flavor change during that final resting period?

I think it's going to add that extra sweetness that you are picking up because we've really, as you mentioned when you were working with Paragon, it's got a honey sweetness to it as well. So we wanted to give it that sweetness and we wanted to just give it a little bit of mellow so that it really was accessible to folks. I think you've got rye whiskies in the marketplace, which certainly everybody has different preferences, but they're much more of a kick and not as easy to work with. This double rye whiskey ends up being a mixologist's favorite. It carries through really nicely in traditional whiskey cocktails. This is my husband Pete's go-to for old-fashioned, is that double rye whiskey.

I can imagine. In fact, I think when we're off air here, as I sit down this evening with my wife when she returns home, I think I might make an old-fashioned with this. It sounds like a great suggestion, and I'm going to take that. Great sipper, though. I mean, this would be wonderful just to carry out to the porch with a couple of friends or your spouse and just sit out on the back porch and sip on and watch the sun go down. It would even hold up to a cigar. I think it would hold up to a lot of things. It's got a little bit of a fresh note to it, too. I'm going to say just a little bit of mint, but that dill, and it's not like. super dill, pickly dill. This is more like dill rice, you know, more aromatic, a little bit. Dill can do a lot of great things to foods in addition to make pickles, I guess. But it has a wonderful effect on rice. I know that. And this just reminds me of that very aromatic dill rice. It's wonderful. Really good. and not like anything else I've had, which is always exciting for me. Thank you very much for making this whiskey.

You're welcome. And I hope you enjoy that porch moment. That's really one of our objectives. We talk about our mission being to be raising a glass to the simple joys of life together. So it's taking that front porch moment and enjoying it with the people that mean a lot to you.

So particularly these two bottles, the ones we have on the show today, the Paragon Bottle & Bond straight bourbon whiskey and the Southern Star double rye straight rye whiskey, these are available on the shelves in liquor stores across multiple states. Can you kind of give me an idea of how far your reach is on distribution?

Sure, our focus today is on the southeast. So within about a five-hour drive of the Charlotte area or the Statesville area is our current focus. That gets us further than it sounds. So that gets us down into Florida, gets us up into New Jersey, gets us over to Kentucky and Tennessee, Indiana. So all of those states are in our current focus area for 2024. We do have distributions sprinkled in some other places like California, Colorado, South Dakota, so New York. So we're working on a few other markets too, but more to come in 2025 and we'll be launching much more robust e-commerce this year. So folks will be able to get things shipped to their home in all the states where it's legal to do so. before too much longer. So that will be really nice because I know there are folks that hear about us through things like your podcast and would like to be able to get a bottle to put on their own shelf, but may not be able to find it at a store quite yet. So we'll continue to work on that growth.

So what are the laws in North Carolina as it relates to shipping spirits?

Unfortunately, in North Carolina, we cannot ship spirits directly to anyone's home. So we have my husband, myself, the other 100 plus distilleries in North Carolina and our Distillers Association of North Carolina, our state trade association. have been working tirelessly for the last, gosh, 13 years now on working to modernize North Carolina's spirits laws. And we've had tremendous success. So there are many, many things that we could not do when we were initially planning for our business that we are now able to do. And all of the distilleries in the state can do when we were first planning distilleries, couldn't sell bottles and we couldn't sell cocktails. So it's pretty hard to run a spirits business when you can't do those two things through your own front door. But we're now able to do both. We can sell unlimited amounts of bottles to folks that come for a visit. We can also provide them with craft cocktails. So that has been a huge change for us. We have tastings in our ABC stores, which are a recent change for us as well. And you can buy bottles in a North Carolina distillery on a Sunday. So we're the only retail location that's able to sell on Sundays. But it has taken us a long time to get there. And we're not to the point yet where we can ship you a bottle to your house in North Carolina. However, there are lots of great partners across the country that are able to do so legally through the three tier system, through normal distribution. It just takes a little bit of movement to get things where they need to go and to make sure that all the regulatory compliance is in place.

Well, fantastic. I think a lot of listeners are looking forward to the day when they can, well, I don't know, get on Sealbox or Drizzly or whatever it might be and order some of your products.

Absolutely, absolutely. We have some now that are available, Reserve Bar and Bar Cart, and there is both a where to buy button on our website at southerndistilling.com and a buy now button that will take you right there if you're not just looking for a location. So we've got it in place and we're going to load it up with the rest of our products so folks aren't limited to just one or two of our selections.

Now, did you mention already how much this bottle of Double Rye was?

That is a $40 suggested retail price for double rye.

Oh my gosh. Oh my gosh. That's like...

It was important for us to keep that accessible, particularly for our on-premise friends. We wanted our bartenders and mixologists to have access to that. And it's tough to do that when you get into a really expensive bottle.

Yeah. I mean, if you can grab this... So you're saying you've got some facilities out there that are grabbing this out of the well and making cocktails with it. That's fantastic.

This is an excellent, excellent rye.

I might have to find a case somewhere. I don't know when I'm coming back to North Carolina. I might have to, well, you said it's in Kentucky. I can probably find this here, right?

Yes.

Oh my goodness. Total wine.

I'm not sure we've hit total wine in Kentucky yet. I do know we're at some of the retailers, but don't know about total wine quite yet. It's always something everybody's working on. But we have our core four. So we've got that Paragon bottled in bond. We have double rye, we have the high rye bourbon, and then our double shot. So that's our core four, our Southern Star double shot bourbon cream, which is a fan favorite. So that one pretty much sells itself if folks have an opportunity to pick up a bottle of that bourbon cream.

I'm kind of a big fan of bourbon cream.

It's always a good way to finish a whiskey tasting.

Absolutely. And they're all a little bit different. I mean, there are some really good ones out there and I don't think anybody really makes a bad bourbon cream. It's almost hard to make a bad bourbon cream, I think, but it's always nice because none of them out there are the same. They differ as much as the whiskeys do, which is fantastic. I did want to talk a little bit about your facility there and what you have available to folks face to face if they were to visit you.

So our brand home at Southern Distilling Company is really launching this summer. So it is an area that we've really had on the on the back burner. A lot of that by intention, since we all were weathering the pandemic was a difficult time to start a hospitality tourism facing. aspect of our business. But we are getting it rolling now and off the ground. We have a big event coming up on June 13th for our kickoff for the Great Race Across America. So we have a car show coming in for folks. and an opportunity to do tours and tastings and cocktails and all of that in June. And that's really the kickoff to the summer season for us and bringing folks through for tours, learning how bourbon gets made in North Carolina and have an opportunity to enjoy our cocktails and some of our special events that we'll have right there on site at the distillery. We've got a 20 acre campus, a beautiful event center, some mini donkeys, which are always fun to see and talk to. and a great place to hang out. So we're looking forward to folks coming off of the highway, off of Interstate 77, Interstate 40, or making the trip in from out of town and learning what we're doing right there in Statesville, North Carolina.

So I'm going to go back to, we were talking in the first half about how you guys are producing somewhere around 60 barrels a day, 20,000 barrels a year. That's a lot of whiskey. You guys are in, A pretty good distributionary, but you're still regional for the moment. You're not nationwide yet. You're going to get there, I'm sure. But it's hard for me to imagine that all of your production goes to your own brands. Are you guys working with other companies to do a contract distilling or otherwise?

Absolutely. Absolutely. That has been part of our business model from the very beginning. And we today support over 130 different clients with doing our bulk whiskeys. Some of that is standard mashbills that are familiar in the industry and others are entirely custom made just the customer specifications. So we are pleased to be working in that space and offering really a custom experience. I think we're unique being family owned. We're extraordinarily customer centric. We offer the regenerative agriculture piece. So having folks know where their grain came from and the authenticity behind that story is important to many of our clients as well as it is to our own brand. But yes, that's always been why we built it the way we did to get started. We knew that we were going to need to have a way to fund sales and marketing for quite a while. It takes a long time to build a brand. And there was a demand out there. There were not a lot of suppliers when we got started 11 years ago. And At the time, none of the suppliers offered any kind of custom distillation. So we were pleased to be one of the early entrants in that space and be able to offer that kind of custom production, aging in a very ideal subtropical environment in North Carolina. And then we also offer coat packing. So folks really can have a start to finish barrel to bottle service with Southern Distilling Company. And we continue to do that today. If we have an opportunity to actually use 20,000 barrels of our own production per year for Southern Star, we are planning to build a second facility to continue doing contract production. So it's been fully engineered and is shovel ready, waiting really for the need in the community to be able to crank that up and produce more barrels for other brands as well.

So are there any of your clients who you have a transparent relationship with and you're able to let others know who you produce for, or is this all kept pretty much private?

The majority is kept confidential, but to be honest, as a distillery that wins a lot of recognitions and is able to really tout our own success with our awards and reviews in the industry, we've built a substantial following. And for brands that are getting started, there's really a nice advantage to being able to say, hey, these folks helped with getting our distillery off the ground or getting our brand started. So there are a few that do take advantage of that opportunity and that we really appreciate. And I will say it's thrilling to see them earn their own awards. We produced the Whiskey for Pond Fay Rye Distillery up in Pennsylvania that is just recently getting going on their own with their own distillation, their own warehousing, but wanted to have a brand to get started with. So they brought their Monongahela Rye down to our distillery and we produced that for them with New York Rye Grain. And they have earned a nice double platinum award with the Ascotts as well. So being able to see our clients having that kind of success with the products we've made is tremendously gratifying to us. And I know gratifying to our clients as well. But it's nice to have those in addition to line up next to our awards. So often we'll see the awards listing come in and we've got a couple of our own that we entered that are winning. And then we see a half dozen of our clients that are following on the list. So it's really pleasing to see that.

I can imagine that's very gratifying to see that. And you're happy for them and you're happy for yourself at the same time.

And everybody wins in those situations. So that's great.

Well, I'd like to give you an opportunity to share with our listeners where they can find you guys on on the internet, on your webpage, your social media, maybe even you want to share your email addresses in case they want to reach out to you. That's entirely up to you. But please take a moment and let our listeners know where they can find Southern Distilling on the internet.

Absolutely. So you can find Southern Distilling Company in many ways. If you want to follow us on Instagram, we are at Southern Distilling. So there's lots of activity happening there. Same Facebook at Southern Distilling and same on LinkedIn, frankly, which is a great place for our business to business contract distilling customers to keep up with the latest news of what's going on at Southern Distilling. So easy to find us in all of those places. Our website, southerndistilling.com. And folks are welcome to call our numbers on the website and our email is just cheers at southern distilling.com as well. So we welcome those inquiries or, you know, use our contact form on the website comes to the same email address. So we'll keep track of all that coming in with the variety of things that people are interested in and talking to a bourbon stillery about.

Fantastic. And you did mention during the episode that on your website, there is a Where to Find Us link where people can see where they can find your products out in the market.

There are two. So there's a Where to Find Us, and that's going to give you all the on-premise and off-premise accounts across all of our markets. So that gives you an idea where we would be on a shelf that you could buy it at a liquor store or what bars and restaurants have brought our products in to use in their bar. And then there's also a buy now button that's going to take you directly to an e-commerce retailer that can fulfill an order.

Fantastic. Well, Vienna, it's been a pleasure to have you on the show. It's been such a great time today. I really enjoyed your whiskeys. I thank you for sharing them with me and sharing them with our listeners. I'm sure that many of our listeners will seek out your products here shortly to try them for themselves. I hope I've done you justice in representing them the way that that I feel that they stood up in tasting. The rye for me was over the top because that's just my profile. But the weeded bottle and bond bourbon was just delightful as well. So both these expressions are worth picking up and I highly suggest our listeners do that. Thank you again. Tell Pete, we wish maybe the next time we get a chance to meet him and maybe out and about at an event or something, or maybe we'll get to North Carolina sometime and visit your facility.

That would be great. We would love to have you anytime. Thank you very much for the time today. It's been a pleasure.

All right. Well, you can find the Bourbon Road on all social media outlets. You can find us on Instagram, Twitter, YouTube, Facebook, threads, TikTok. I think I got them all. Yeah, we're on all those places. We put a show out every single week on Wednesdays. You'll hear us having a great time, sitting down with a great guest like Vienna Barger and talking about their whiskies. Sometimes we'll just be a few of us sitting in a room exploring some whiskies together. Sometimes we'll have a guest on, a musician or a poet or an author, anybody who loves the whiskey business and loves to sit down with a good shot of bourbon. We'll have them on the show. We always have a great time. We hope you'll listen to us every single week. The best way to make sure you don't miss a show is scroll up to the top of that app you're on, hit that subscribe button. That way, when we put out a new episode, you'll get that bell notification saying, these jokers have dropped another one. You'll be able to listen to us. We're almost to 400 folks. And I think we got something big planned for the 400th episode. So make sure you're looking out for that. But until the next time, we'll see you down the Bourbon Road.

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